| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9] > | Do you think Proz should add Trados certification as translators search criteria? Thread poster: Pablo Bouvier
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Sonja Tomaskovic (X) 
Germany
Local time: 09:58
English to German
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| Money - that's the only reason | Aug 21, 2007 |
Selcuk Akyuz wrote:
Is it a joke? Do you plan to add 2008, 2009 versions as well.
This is ridiculous.
Selcuk,
Did you really believe they introduced certification for the purpose of showing potential outsourcerers that you (as a SDL Trados user) know anything about the software? Come on, it is all about money, nothing else.
Sonja
| | | | Jerzy Czopik
Germany
Local time: 09:58
Member (2003)
Polish to German
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| Please inform yourself right before spreading false news | Aug 21, 2007 |
Sonja Tomaskovic wrote: Selcuk Akyuz wrote:
Is it a joke? Do you plan to add 2008, 2009 versions as well.
This is ridiculous.
Selcuk, Did you really believe they introduced certification for the purpose of showing potential outsourcerers that you (as a SDL Trados user) know anything about the software? Come on, it is all about money, nothing else. Sonja
If you are already SDL Trados 2006 certified the certification exam for SDL Trados 2007 is free. You just need to pass the upgrade exam and then are certified on no additional cost.
Please also not the following remark, which can be found on SDL's page:
Note: This is a translation technology certification - this does not test your fluency or expertise in subject matter or language.
Jerzy
| | | | cmwilliams (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:58
French to English
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Selcuk Akyuz wrote:
As a member of Proz.com I don't want it displayed or asked in the Freelancers Directory. And I know I am not alone here.
I have already voiced my concern about the freelancers search directory and do not see why it should be included as one of the main options, as other types of credentials (more specifically related to translation skills) are not highlighted.
As a Proz member, I do not want to be a part of any 'partnership' that favours any particular company in this way. I suppose that means that I must seriously consider whether I want to continue supporting Proz. in the future.
| | | | Jerzy Czopik
Germany
Local time: 09:58
Member (2003)
Polish to German
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| I see this quite opposite | Aug 21, 2007 |
And I welcome the possibility to being able to show this in my profile and to be searched by this criterion. And I know I'm not alone here.
What now?
Jerzy
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| Layout and presentation of information | Aug 21, 2007 |
Jerzy Czopik wrote:
And I welcome the possibility to being able to show this in my profile and to be searched by this criterion. And I know I'm not alone here.
What now?
The main search criterion should be the tool used. The certification option should only appear when the tool has been chosen. This is already the case in the job posting dialogue.
The way the freelance directory search screen is arranged at present, the company SDL Trados corners 3 (three) major dialogue boxes (2 options in the "Translator Productivity Software" box, plus 2 separate main boxes for two separate certification boxes for "SDL Trados" and "SDLX")
Visually, SDL Trados is thus given three times more importance than the choice of the target language. And it is also given three times more weight than the choice of the field of expertise.
I do not object to you showcasing your use of and certification in SDL Trados or any other tool, nor do I have any problem with these items being included in job posting or freelancer searches. It's just a question of balance. At the moment, the freelancer search screen and the infamous press release are badly off balance.
As to the speculations about everything being "all about money", I'm afraid that ProZ and SDL Trados have brought this upon themselves.
Mike Kidd almost (!!!) admitted these errors by saying
we need to be more specific in our communications going forward.
But that is not enough. To remove the justifiable suspicions and speculations, it would be better if the site staff could correct the mistakes of the past (specifically: the wording of the press release and the layout of the freelancer directory search).
| | | | Gerard de Noord
France
Local time: 09:58
Member (2003)
English to Dutch
+ ...
Jerzy Czopik wrote:
And I welcome the possibility to being able to show this in my profile and to be searched by this criterion. And I know I'm not alone here.
What now?
Jerzy
Don't worry, Jerzy,
This new feature will be introduced.
Regards,
Gerard
| | | | cmwilliams (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:58
French to English
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| This is precisely the problem | Aug 21, 2007 |
Victor Dewsbery wrote:
The way the freelance directory search screen is arranged at present, the company SDL Trados corners 3 (three) major dialogue boxes (2 options in the "Translator Productivity Software" box, plus 2 separate main boxes for two separate certification boxes for "SDL Trados" and "SDLX")
Visually, SDL Trados is thus given three times more importance than the choice of the target language. And it is also given three times more weight than the choice of the field of expertise.
I do not object to you showcasing your use of and certification in SDL Trados or any other tool, nor do I have any problem with these items being included in job posting or freelancer searches. It's just a question of balance. At the moment, the freelancer search screen and the infamous press release are badly off balance.
Thanks, Victor, for presenting it so clearly.
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Jerzy Czopik wrote:
After having read numerous discussions about CAT tools in general I slowly get the impression, that there are a lot of Trados hater out there, who would even go so far and say, that Trados user are just worser translatos than others, but they get jobs by misusing the Trados market position. As Trados user I often feel personally insulted in such discussions.
Hate is a pretty strong word, and I wouldn't go that far but many translators are certainly erked by the whole business of jobs being posted with "Trados required", "Trados essential", as if this was some guarantee of finding the person with the right expertise for the job, and Trados certification with its "peace of mind for end-user corporations looking to deliver high quality translations" is just another step in the wrong direction. It usually means the outsourcer knows little about translation or the way translators work and even less about CAT tools in general.
Trados users are not worse translators than others, but many of them have probably been misled by dishonest advertising into thinking that they somehow must have Trados and certification to survive in the market.
I'm sorry you feel personally insulted by all this but I have noticed that you do tend to jump very quickly to the defense of SDL/Trados and don't seem to accept any criticism of their crass advertising or the mediocre performance and poor value of their tools.
Best regards,
David
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Jerzy Czopik
Germany
Local time: 09:58
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
| Please don't interpret my words as would they have been written by a native speaker | Aug 24, 2007 |
Please consider, that English is NOT my working language and even after so many years on ProZ using English on daily basis I do not have the necessary fine feeling for all what might lay in behing of my words.
I'll try to make my mind clear here, so please try to understand me straight, without looking behind my words. If you take into consideration, that my usual writing language is German, this might be helpful.
What I meant with "being insulted" is, that (this is a general ... See more Please consider, that English is NOT my working language and even after so many years on ProZ using English on daily basis I do not have the necessary fine feeling for all what might lay in behing of my words.
I'll try to make my mind clear here, so please try to understand me straight, without looking behind my words. If you take into consideration, that my usual writing language is German, this might be helpful.
What I meant with "being insulted" is, that (this is a general remark, connected to all possible threads here and in other mailing list) people start to complain about Trados making things wrong, when in fact they are using it wrong. If you tell them that, they are offended. I often try to explain why something goes wrong, mostly it is because the autor of the document made some errors. But people tend to say, this is Trados problem and not their.
This is not meant personaly in any way, but before I start complaing about something I'd try to learn how to use it properly. This has nothing to do with the problem discussed here, but again there are to many general "Trados is not good" what I do not like.
So you are maybe right, that I tend to find arguments in favour for Trados, but I hoped I try to do so when the acusations (sorry, I don't have a weaker and better word for that) are based on user errors.
OTOH you should know me as a helpful person, who almost always tries to help user when they have problems. I do accept criticism, when it has founded reasons - which is quite seldom the case. In this very case I must admit, that the wording in question is really misleading. Nevertheless, I'm quite sure, would similar wording come from any other vendor, no one (or only very few) would cry.
Jerzy ▲ Collapse
| | | | Gerard de Noord
France
Local time: 09:58
Member (2003)
English to Dutch
+ ...
| Off topic: I know exactly what you mean | Aug 24, 2007 |
Jerzy Czopik wrote:
What I meant with "being insulted" is, that (this is a general remark, connected to all possible threads here and in other mailing list) people start to complain about Trados making things wrong, when in fact they are using it wrong. If you tell them that, they are offended. I often try to explain why something goes wrong, mostly it is because the autor of the document made some errors. But people tend to say, this is Trados problem and not their.
Jerzy
I get 'infuriated' ever so often. It's so unfair to post with a subject like "Annoying bug in WordFast", that lingers all day on the homepage of Proz.com. Such postings are often made by colleagues who haven't got a clue about the use of Wordfast nor Microsoft Word. Pointing to a manual seems to be rude, nowadays, and even quoting some phrases from the respective manuals doesn't always make you very popular. You're lucky when you receive a proper thank you.
Regards,
Gerard
| | | | Mike Kidd (X)
United States
Hello,
Please note that last Thursday we modified the sentence in the press release (on our site) referring to “quality” to more clearly reflect its meaning in context of using a CAT tool. We made this change in response to the feedback presented in this forum and with editorial review and contribution from two member participants.
We also initiated and conducted a special and lengthy feedback review session with the folks in charge of certification at SDL TRADOS... See more Hello,
Please note that last Thursday we modified the sentence in the press release (on our site) referring to “quality” to more clearly reflect its meaning in context of using a CAT tool. We made this change in response to the feedback presented in this forum and with editorial review and contribution from two member participants.
We also initiated and conducted a special and lengthy feedback review session with the folks in charge of certification at SDL TRADOS Technologies to present and discuss your comments in detail. They appreciated your comments and found them helpful in understanding how they could improve their program. I am also sure they would welcome comments from any of you directly. If you would like to connect with them, please let me know.
Regarding how the certification check box is presented in the directory search, we are reviewing that again in context of the feedback presented here and elsewhere.
Again, thank you all for your time and comment on these important matters. Please feel free to contact me directly to discuss further.
Best,
Mike ▲ Collapse
| | | | Ralf Lemster
Germany
Local time: 09:58
English to German
+ ...
| Thanks, Mike | Aug 27, 2007 |
Much appreciated.
Best regards,
Ralf
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larserik
Sweden
Local time: 09:58
Albanian to Swedish
| Unqualified certifier | Aug 29, 2007 |
Before the certifier starts talking about quality, what about doing something to the new and old flaws and bugs in their software?
(Have a look at TW_users if you want a list of the problems)
L-E
| | | | DavidHardy
Local time: 08:58
Portuguese to English
| proz's greatest strength | Aug 30, 2007 |
A lot of comments here about Trados - what about Proz? It provides a(n enhanced) service to paid users and also a service to unpaid users without compromising its image as a neutral resource for translators. I think it has to be very careful in this kind of issue to be seen to keep its neutrality.
[Edited at 2007-08-30 21:12]
| | | | jmd (X)
Local time: 09:58
English to Slovenian
+ ...
| Pulling wool over our own eyes, are we? | Aug 31, 2007 |
DavidHardy wrote:
A lot of comments here about Trados - what about Proz? It provides a(n enhanced) service to paid users and also a service to unpaid users without compromising its image as a neutral resource for translators. I think it has to be very careful in this kind of issue to be seen to keep its neutrality.
[Edited at 2007-08-30 21:12]
Proz And SDL are business partners, honey.
Neutrality my foot!
Mia
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