Apr 6, 2022 21:57
2 yrs ago
69 viewers *
English term

Would

Non-PRO English Other General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters
Hello. I'm currently translating a book from my mother tongue, Portuguese, to English.

When translating certain sentences about the past, which describre recurrence, I repeatedly resort to *would* in situations in which I believe I could also use the simple past. For example: "When they saw her coming, they would always stop and whisper cruelties." Is the use of *would* there grammatically correct? And does it describe the recurrence of action that I intend? Is it the same in meaning as using the simple past? as in: "When they saw her coming, they always stopped and whispered cruelties."

I am aware that *would*, as opposed to *used to*, requires a time frame to be used in the past. But is that time reference necessary for every sentence, in the context of storytelling, when the story is already taking place and being written in the past? For example, could I start the next sentence in that story with *would*? as in: "She would pretend she couldn’t hear them and would move on with her day, but deep down she was very hurt."

Finally, is the switching back and forth between *simple past*, *would*, and *past perfect* ungrammatical or confusing in any way? And is it aesthetically unpleasant? Am I better off just using the simple past in all those situations?

I know I asked a lot of questions, but I would be grateful for the answer to just one of them.
Change log

Apr 7, 2022 00:12: Mario Freitas changed "Language pair" from "Portuguese to English" to "English to Portuguese"

Apr 7, 2022 06:47: Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida changed "Language pair" from "English to Portuguese" to "Portuguese to English"

Apr 7, 2022 15:30: philgoddard changed "Language pair" from "Portuguese to English" to "English" , "Field" from "Art/Literary" to "Other"

Apr 8, 2022 20:52: AllegroTrans changed "Level" from "PRO" to "Non-PRO"

Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

Non-PRO (3): Yvonne Gallagher, Tony M, AllegroTrans

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Discussion

Augusto Vieira (asker) Apr 8, 2022:
To everyone who answered my question, thank you very much; all comments were helpful.
Oliver Simões Apr 7, 2022:
Augusto, I suggest moving your question to the English-only forum, it does not pertain to Portuguese to English translation. Actually, it requires no translation at all.

Responses

+6
10 hrs
Selected

Would, used to and simple past have different uses

Look at this explanation from the British Council:

https://learnenglish.britishcouncil.org/grammar/intermediate...
Peer comment(s):

agree Magdalena Godoy Bonnet
6 hrs
Thank you.
agree Tony M
7 hrs
Thank you.
agree Charlotte Fleming
8 hrs
Thank you.
agree Anastasia Kalantzi
11 hrs
Thank you!
agree AllegroTrans
13 hrs
Thank you!
agree Tina Vonhof (X) : I would put it this way: the simple past emphasises the action, whereas 'used to' or 'would' emphasises the repetitive nature of the action.
2 days 6 hrs
Exactly, thank you!
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Selected automatically based on peer agreement."
+1
2 hrs

They are correct

All your sentences are grammatically correct. Which form to use is mostly a matter of style in the given context.


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Note added at 2 hrs (2022-04-07 00:20:27 GMT)
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And yes, your sentences have the intended meaning.
Peer comment(s):

agree Anastasia Kalantzi
19 hrs
thanks
Something went wrong...
+1
17 hrs

1 - Yes, accurate traditional syntax; 2 - No, don't switch back and forth

The 'would' in repeated or habitual acts in the past is grammaticized. I bring the following lines of Otto Jespersen (the book reference will be below):

"Further 'would' denotes repeated or habitual acts in the past, chiefly such acts as are consequences of the subject's nature or character ([...] in the preterit it is found in all three persons; the quotation from Dickens shows various synonymous expressions).
[....] 'she would hang on him, as if encrease of appetite had growne by what it fed on' [...] [Goldam] 'the Squire would sometimes fall asleep in the most pathetic parts of my sermon' [...] 'On Saturday Mr Dobey came down; and Florence and Paul would go to his hotel, and have tea' [...] [Stevenson] 'When I would come back from these excursions, I was often plunged into a kind of wonder' [...] [Aumonier] '[every time when she was sitting to a painter] they spoke very little till the work was finished, when a man would bring in a trav of tea-things' [= and then...] [...] [Ahuxley] 'every twenty miles or so, we would catch glimpses of a thing which seemed, at first, only a white cloud' [...]
In a conditional clause: [Bentley] [...] 'If he was having one of these rages in the library and Mrs Manderson would come into the rooom, he would be all calm and cold again in an instant' [...]".
(Modern English Grammar on Historical Principles, Part IV: Syntax, third volume. London. George Allen & Unwin LTD. 1932. Pages 303-4 [topic 19.1(6)])

Regarding your whole work, you should keep the 'would'. We assume that in your source material this kind of sentence has always the same structure, so you have no reason to switch back and forth from 'would' to another structure.
Peer comment(s):

agree Anastasia Kalantzi
4 hrs
Thanks, Anastasia.
Something went wrong...
+3
18 hrs

used for characteristic actions

Yes, your questions are really about basic grammar rather than translation.

First of all, it is OK to vary the tenses but it really depends on the style you want to achieve so, unless you are expert, it's better to keep it simple.

Oliver has given an example sentence with "would" but unfortunately, it is not very idiomatic

"Then he would wash; then he would eat his toast; then he would read his paper by the bright burning fire of electric coals."

In idiomatic English that would be: First he would wash, then eat his toast,(and) read his paper by the fire.
"fire of bright burning electric coals" (really not correct)

Would is NOT always interchangeable with "used to"

It cannot be used for a state

Also, unlike "used to" it must have a time frame established


e.g. I used to smoke (already clear it is in the past and you no longer smoke)

When I was younger, I would smoke a pack of cigarettes each day (habit at that time)

To summarise, as the link below says:

"... the use of "would" is more restricted than that of "used to". Therefore, if you aren't sure which one to use, it's best to choose "used to."

https://www.britannica.com/dictionary/eb/qa/the-difference-b...

examples of characteristic actions

My grandmother would always spoil me whenever I visited/used to visit her
OR
Whenever I visited/used to visit my grandmother she would always spoil me

Back then, he would always have a glass of sherry after dinner

She used to love playing with her dolls
When she was young, she would spend hours playing with her dolls (a characteristic habit she had at that time)
Peer comment(s):

agree Tony M : Very well explained, Yvonne !
1 hr
Thanks Tony:-)
agree Anastasia Kalantzi : Sadly,we're simply lost in translation and through radically different educational & cultural political systems. Hope some day we'll meet face to face. The thing is in Greece one has the right to teach all languages only after 4years University
3 hrs
OMG. You've edited your comment 13 times now and still haven't got the point.
agree AllegroTrans
6 hrs
Thanks:-)
Something went wrong...
+6
2 hrs

would indicates habitual actions in the past

Habitual actions in the past

We use would to refer to typical habitual actions and events in the past. This is usually a formal use and it often occurs in stories (narratives):

I had a friend from Albany, which is about 36 miles away, and we would meet every Thursday morning and she would help us.

Then he would wash; then he would eat his toast; then he would read his paper by the bright burning fire of electric coals.

Warning:
We can’t use would in this way to talk about states. In these cases, we say used to instead of would:

I used to live in Melbourne when I was a kid.
Not: I would live in Melbourne when I was a kid.

Source: Cambridge Dictionary
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/grammar/british-grammar/...



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Note added at 2 hrs (2022-04-07 00:10:29 GMT)
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In my opinion, switching back and forth between those three verb tenses can be confused, not necessarily ungrammatical. It all depends on your specific context.

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Note added at 1 day 4 hrs (2022-04-08 02:05:41 GMT)
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Correction: can be confusing...
Peer comment(s):

agree Katarina Peters : yes, would is used in lieu of used to
32 mins
agree philgoddard
15 hrs
agree Tony M : 'would' is definitely indicated if followed by 'always' etc. to reinforce the habitual nature; without the 'always', a simply past would rather sugest 'on one particular occasion' A simple test: could you replace it with 'was/were in the habit of ...-ing'
16 hrs
neutral Yvonne Gallagher : I agree with a lot of this but not with your example sentence. Sorry, but it just isn't idiomatic
16 hrs
agree Veronica Allievi : I also heard a USA teacher online say that "temporary states" might also admit "would", but they do not in traditional grammar books.
16 hrs
agree Anastasia Kalantzi : I can still remember he would do anything for me to take pleasure of each moment we've been spending together and would be even ready to offer me the moon itself with his own hands.
19 hrs
agree AllegroTrans
22 hrs
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